The ninth of dec 2000 we received this Bible-evidence review called 'Deception of Man's timekeeping - Bible evidence review'. Anyone wishing to respond to this article or the communication following here may send an e-mail from the feedback-page.


Deception of Man's timekeeping - Bible evidence review

Genesis 1 relates GOD creating timekeeping at the first day before the globe was created, so God's time- keeping was absolute (same time everywhere) not mapped onto different times for different parts of the globe(local time). Man devised local time many millennia later without God's authority and set up different Jewish and international time systems neither of which conform to the Bible, yet most people use them , even for Holy days,Gods signs to His people, this is seriously wrong. Bible evidence summarised below:

----Genesis 2:2: And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 2:3: And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

[Notes: At the end of the work of creation the seventh day is blessed (made happy , blissful) quite unconditionally, solely because God rested, so simply by keeping this day there is a blessing at this time. The day is also made separate from other days for God's purpose(sanctified), but there is no commandment to keep it at this time and no agreement to keep it is sought from the creation. The day is made available to the whole creation, there are no restrictions on who can make use of it if they should ever choose to at this time]

----John 1:1: In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 1:2: The same was in the beginning with God. 1:3: All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made

----John 1:14: And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. 1:15: John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me .

---John1:29: The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. 1:30: This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he was before me.

---Mark 2:27: And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: 2:28: Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath

[Notes. Jesus Christ was the Word and he said that the sabbath was made for man, there are no conditions here, no agreement or covenant, no commandment to keep sabbath, no punishment for not doing so. A simple statement that the sabbath was made for man. Everyone therefore can take part in the sabbath, partaking of its blessing, a time made separate to God's purpose (sanctified), confirmed by Christ as for everyone - but not as a commandment, the blessing and keeping separate time for God's purpose are optional for anyone who is not in a covenant with God to keep the sabbath. Israel, the chosen people of God , however had made a covenant with God which among other things was to keep the sabbath, - but they failed to keep to it and the covenant was finally terminated at Christ's death, [the abomination of having their own messiah killed that brought desolation on Israel], the end of their old agreement with God - but note that this only concerns Israel, not everyone else - the sabbath in particular is still an option for everyone ( including Israel), it is only the commandment to keep it by an agreement with God by Israel that ended at Christ's death (together with the other rules of the covenant) - so no-one is forced to keep it any more, but they may if they wish to, it is easy to confirm that the sabbath continues after Christ's death (see below).

---Isiah 56:1: Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed. 56:2: Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil. 56:3: Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree. 56:4: For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; 56:5: Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. 56:6: Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; 56:7: Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people. 56:8: The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.


Matthew 24:13: But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 24:14: And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. 24:15: When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 24:16: Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 24:17: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 24:18: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 24:19: And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 24:20: But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 24:21: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

[Notes. There it is in Isiah and at the end of Matt. 24:20 in the above passages still in existence long after the death of Christ]

Nehemiah 9:13: Thou camest down also upon mount Sinai, and spakest with them from heaven, and gavest them right judgments, and true laws, good statutes and commandments: 9:14: And madest known unto them thy holy sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses thy servant: 9:15: And gavest them bread from heaven for their hunger, and broughtest forth water for them out of the rock for their thirst, and promisedst them that they should go in to possess the land which thou hadst sworn to give them.

[Notes: Note that the making-known of the sabbath is separate from the giving of commandments, the commandment to keep the laws, and the promise of the land - in particular the sabbath was in existence before Israel and was made known to Israel - the agreement to keep the sabbath, the 4th commandment, is separate from the making known of the sabbath. So what is taken away with the ending of the covenant through persistent disobedience is the commandment to keep the sabbath, not the sabbath itself - the sabbath is thus a blessing for everyone, throughout time, a very special day, the seventh, made separate to God's purpose and Israel were commanded to keep it under their covenant with God for a period from their time in Sinai up to the death of Christ - nobody else was commanded to keep it and Israel's agreement to do so by the 4th commandment has long since terminated at the time of their worst abomination that brought desolation finally upon them for their disobedience to their God, almost unbelievably to not recognise the long-awaited messiah and to have Him killed. The keeping of sabbath actually carried the death penalty for disobedience (see below) under God's agreement with Israel, that is how important it was to God that they maintained the separateness of the seventh day and God set it up as a very sign to show He was their God and they were His people - both these show how important is the seventh day, look at what God is attaching to it - the death penalty for disobedience whilst their covenant is in force and for it to be a sign between God and them as His people:

Ezekiel 20:11: And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them. 20:12: Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.

---Exodus 31:12: And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 31:13: Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you. 31:14: Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. 31:15: Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. 31:16: Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. 31:17: It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed. 31:18: And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

[Notes.- notice again in the instructions by God to Moses, extensive emphasis of the importance of the sign of the seventh day sabbath, , the one established at the seventh day from the beginning, now as a sign between God and Israel to be kept under punishment of being cut off from Israel and of death for defilement by working on sabbath by the children of Israel. Israel were clearly meant to take this very seriously indeed and it is perhaps not surprising that some became legalistically exact in trying to divide work from not work. Importantly, although Israel had polluted her sabbaths and was made desolate for disobedience, still the sabbath was kept and not lost in the resulting desolation, the sign of God was still available to be kept if they would do so:

Chronicles 36:20: And them that had escaped from the sword carried he away to Babylon; where they were servants to him and his sons until the reign of the kingdom of Persia: `36:21: To fulfill the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had enjoyed her sabbaths: for as long as she lay desolate she kept sabbath, to fulfill threescore and ten years.

Notes: God has warned us that He changes the times as recorded by Daniel: Dan 2:20: Daniel answered and said, Blessed be the name of God for ever and ever: for wisdom and might are his: 2:21: And he changeth the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding: 2:22: He revealeth the deep and secret things: he knoweth what is in the darkness, and the light dwelleth with him.

Notes: How then could God take away the blessing of the sabbath, the very sign between Him and His chosen when they had clung to knowing when the sabbath was even through desolation, it seems impossible to do, particularly when it is necessary to keep the knowledge of when the sabbath is for the future restoration of the remnant of Israel? Let us see if you will how this was achieved without even taking away the possibility of keeping the sabbath for those who chose (and choose) to do so with this motivation from Ecclesiastes.

Ecc 8:5 Whoso keepeth the commandment shall feel no evil thing: and a wise man's heart discerneth both time and judgment why should a man , wise of heart, be discerning time -why is there any need to? The answer has already been given above by Daniel(2:21) we must expect that the times change by God changing them. This seems more than curious - God's sign to His people is known just by counting the days to the seventh and they have shown an obsession‚ for keeping up this counting beyond even the keeping of God's laws by them and even during the punishments for their failures to keep their agreements - the only way to change the time of the sabbath for them is to change the way that time is reckoned, to change the days to something other than God's days. Perhaps you think that people, and especially perhaps the legalistically exact‚ Jews, would never fall for this, but it really has happened and, if you will, here is the proof of the truth about the changing of timekeeping for days:

First some historical facts about timekeeping by man: The Babylonians began their day at sunrise. The ancient Jews began the day at sunset. The Egyptians and the Romans were the first to begin the day at midnight. The only reason for changing times and having an international date line is to keep 12:00 noon at approximately the same time in every part of the world. The Early Christians and Israel used a composite local time system based on starting days at local sunset, not keeping sunset in Jerusalem as their standard when on a different longitude.

Now what did God say about days:

Genesis 1:5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Leviticus 23:32: It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath

[Notes: God's days start at sunset with the evening then - but from sunset to sunset is NOT a fixed length of clock time, so God's days vary in length slightly throughout the year, this is very different from the Roman/Egyptian system where the days are much more constant in length - note that the days not only start at a different event, but are not even the same length or variability in these two systems, these systems are not compatible or interchangeable. The Roman system followed their conquests and shaped the International time standard, but what of Israel? It seems that from their behavior they thought they could continue counting local sunsets and resisting Roman timekeeping and that was all that was needed even as they were scattered among other nations. This is indeed significant because by the time of Israel's worst abomination against their God the knowledge of how to keep absolute time was available, but mankind as a whole seems to have ignored the implications until people migrating east met people migrating west around the globe and found that despite all care, they appeared definitively to be on different days - and both had a clear call to be right by their chosen time system - something was very wrong, and it was the time system to blame - but still they did not return to absolute time of God's creation (see later) which would have solved the problems. Widespread recognition of the problem does not seem to be documented until as recently as Magellan's global circumnavigation eastwards starting in 1522 and even he was amazed when he was confronted with the real consequences of the timekeeping system - that he had gained a day somehow - by going around eastwards, the sun had risen and set one more time for him than for people who stayed put - his days , measured by the sun, had all been shortened by his movement towards the sunrise all the way around the globe. The problem strangely wasn't tackled systematically‚ by mankind until in1884 when the International Meridian Conference in Washington, DC,met and instead of establishing absolute time worldwide, they devised a procedure to create 24 zones all around the world with 24 standard meridians ( every 15° east and west of 0° (at Greenwich, England) which were set as the centers of the zones of different local times‚ and the international date line‚(IDL) was invented where time was supposed to jump by one day, this line representing the 180° meridian in the Pacific Ocean - but countries, islands and even states did not want to be divided into several zones, so the boundaries of zones were modified considerably from just straight north-south lines - and the boundaries and dateline have continued to be changed repeatedly since then (latest was I believe Kirbati altering the IDL in 1995. ) The Jews might have noticed the sunset simply did not occur for timing days all over the globe, they might have seen that the dateline must violate the separateness, length and even existence of Holy days, but no, they invented their own chalakhic‚ date line with all the same abominations but the line was in a different place to the IDL - then when Jews moved east of the line (fleeing from the Nazis), it was moved further east, and then once again as Jews moved further east.. Every time the line was moved across someone, their week immediately did not have 6 working days and one sabbath, there was a day difference, the counting just didn't work any more - the system of local times corrupted God's structure of time for the week, keeping local times made a mockery of the very local time sign of God to His people (but this wasn't the real sabbath or the real sign which are absolutely distinct and Holy) - people understandably got confused, many started keeping double Holy days so as not to miss one - not realising that they were not keeping the Holy days only because of the false local time system Local timekeeping is an incomplete mapping of time onto a globe that necessitates forming a date line on that globe... It cannot exist without a globe - the account of Genesis 1 shows that the globe was created at the third day - but time was created at the first, the very first day, so there was not any possibility of a dateline for time when it was made because there was no surface to map it onto, no globe. Therefore the time that God created was absolute time and could not be local. Local time was created only by mankind late in his history - complete with its paradoxes and artificial datelines, it was and is no good,but in particular it is disastrous for man because it gives the wrong time for Holy sabbaths over most of the earth and violates the distinctness, length, and even existence of the apparent sign of God to His people under local time.

We have been warned to avoid BOTH Jewish fables and commandments of men ( Note at this point that Jews have their own defined chalakhic dateline separate from the INTERNATIONAL DATE LINE and that there is no authority of God for either - and that both date lines have changed many times, these lines each pretend to demarcate the Holy sabbath in space on the globe rather than time (as its Biblical definition is).. you can cross these lines and enter or leave the sabbath at any time of day according to this ambiguous and varying tradition/fable of mankind - this is not God's way of entering and leaving sabbaths ):

Tts 1:14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

We are exhorted over and over to discern the truth, yet the standard International timekeeping system that most use for something as important as timing Holy days is full of paradoxes, does not define time everywhere, allows days to start and end at any time of day by crossing the dateline (thus defiling the sanctity of Holy days, allows up to two sabbaths per week or even seven working days in a week), in short it is a lie and an abomination before God as it deceives about His sign to His people by setting a false parody of that sign:

1Jo 2:21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

2 Thes 2:10: And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.2:11: And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:2:12: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Jhn 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

Isa 59:4 None calleth for justice, nor [any] pleadeth for truth: they trust in vanity, and speak lies; they conceive mischief, and bring forth iniquity.

Jer 5:3 O LORD, [are] not thine eyes upon the truth? thou hast stricken them, but they have not grieved; thou hast consumed them, [but] they have refused to receive correction: they have made their faces harder than a rock; they have refused to return.

Jer 9:3 And they bend their tongues [like] their bow [for] lies: but they are not valiant for the truth upon the earth; for they proceed from evil to evil, and they know not me, saith the LORD.

Jer 9:6 Thine habitation [is] in the midst of deceit; through deceit they refuse to know me, saith the LORD.

Pro 3:3 Let not mercy and truth forsake thee: bind them about thy neck; write them upon the table of thine heart:

Isa 59:13 In transgressing and lying against the LORD, and departing away from our God, speaking oppression and revolt, conceiving and uttering from the heart words of falsehood. Isa 59:14 And judgment is turned away backward, and justice standeth afar off: for truth is fallen in the street, and equity cannot enter. Isa 59:15 Yea, truth faileth; and he [that] departeth from evil maketh himself a prey: and the LORD saw [it], and it displeased him that [there was] no judgment.

Ecclesiastes 12:14: For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

Many people on earth are so confused by the dateline that they celebrate their Holy days twice, trying to avoid disobedience to God, but of course failing, it is the acceptance of the time system that causes this confusion and God is not author of confusion: 1Cr 14:33 For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

In 1995 the island country of Kiribati in the Pacific Ocean decided to move the International Date Line so that their country wouldn't be divided by the line any longer. Previously, in the eastern part of the country it would be Tuesday while the western part of the country was Monday. Recognition of the change is slowing coming about. Now consider what happened in the week of the change, for half the island that week changed its length by a day.. are we to say that God's week can have other than seven days - that is what actually happened here if you accept the system of the International date line, is it hard to discern that this is a false system, that it is lying to us. Surely we know God's week has seven days - it cannot be changed, messed around with in this manner- and the dateline has moved very many times - as has the Jewish dateline.. which do you believe in and why?.. I cannot believe in any dateline because of these disagreements with God caused by the very system of datelines, worst of all that they deny the very separateness of the sign of God - and have only the varying authorities of men to support them, men who can't even agree on just one line or even that such a line should be invariant. Once again I have to say this is not the work of God and it speaks against God's truth in many ways, we cannot use such a system of lies for timing our keeping of Holy sabbaths..this is the horrendous truth, MOST people are being deceived into trying vainly to do exactly this. God unconditionally blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, separated it for his purpose: Gen.2:3: And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made. If we want this blessing we have to keep God's Sabbath - although by Christ's sacrifice we are not under the original ordinance to do so under pain of death if we don't -but receiving this blessing relies on our keeping God's timing, not the false timekeeping of local times with datelines - but instead the natural sense of time that it is the same for everyone, that everyone has the same time - it even sounds obvious to say it, but it really doesn't happen in the world for most people - we therefore need to re-synchronise to a single time for everyone worldwide that agrees with the events of the Bible and abandon the system of lies at the very least for the timing of Holy days.. The instruction in the Bible is to celebrate Sabbath from evening to evening but evening does not occur daily all over the world - so this must have referred to a specific place, where the instruction is given, not to imply that local sunset was everywhere the start of days.

Local sunset does not exist for many people, they cannot time days that way! The various arbitrary and variable datelines on the globe make wholly arbitrary man-made divisions of days and peoples. Let us all on the planet return to celebrating the real absolute sign of God, His holy and blessed weekly Sabbath - at the same time worldwide for everyone by acknowledging that that which is holy should not be made into a false sign, indistinct and violable, by man's date lines and local timekeeping.

Isiah.56:1: Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed. 56:2: Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the Sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil. 56:3: Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree. 56:4: For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my Sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; 56:5: Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. 56:6: Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the Sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

56:7: Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

In love of God and people and truth, R. W. C.



Enschede 12-8-2000

Dear Mister C.

We carefully read your review of the Bible references about timekeeping and thank you for your study. We wholly subscribe to your vision that one can doubt about a lof of culture that has risen from man-made timeschedules. Indeed originally God's time was uniform. We call this cosmic time: the time of the expanding universe describing a uniform space-time. Cyclic time though was also created by the selfsame God and we again agree with your saying that it is man's duty to God to respect the natural of time - in any form- and that we should be very careful with any political or religious fixation. Each respect of time, however thwarted it may be is a respect for God Himself who assumed the form of time. So let us not judge another man's devotion.

The idea of the Sabbath is about the most important thing about time we embrace of the Holy Book. It is the division of time over a year - including datelines as you say - that one may worry about. We rest at the seventh day, but when does the first start again? As you say one can have irregular time periods aligning with God's nature as one can observe with moonphases. Thus we at The Order of Time hold on to one division provided by different holy books: The Bible, The Koran and The Srimad Bhagavatam. From those books together we have arrived at the accord of the Full Calendar of Order that is in respect of the Sabbath as the seventh day. The division of time for the year we took from the Hindu-scripture that provides for 15 -day periods also found in the old roman fasti-calendar. And last but not least we respect the regularity of the moon by having days of contemplation on the lunar phases. Thus we have arrived at a comprehensive concept of time that is as close to the scriptures of God in the world as can be and thus makes a holy reference of timekeeping to our present political and commercial confusion of standard time and its one-sided calendar. Further details of management as celebrating the eleventh or the ninth day of a month with this reference we have further left to each his personal religious concerns.

webmaster The Order of Time


received 12-10-2000

Dear Webmaster,

I would like to let you know that I have read and appreciated the discussion about

-Deception of Man's timekeeping - Bible evidence review- and your answer thereto on your Discussion page of -Theorderoftime-site.

It is a very important subject how people think about time and relating to time. That everyone must be let free how to relate to time and interpret time, firstly, is for me the most important. Since I have been struggling with time for a long time myself, I feel I can add a little to this discussion.

I first did not even understand that I had a problem with time. (Time is God) I have also studied the Bible to find an answer, but could not deal with all the statements the way it is presented. I do believe in a holy day, to be spent for God and his creation. I searched further reading the holy books of different religions. But, relating to time, like everyone, did not help really to overcome my problems and live a more conscious life. Back to nature, back to God. I thought: But God must have told us somehow, somewhere, how to live our lives and how to live it in a happy way and serve Him the best way possible.

In my opinion, time, the way it is respected nowadays, does not really lead to that goal. Even not, when we respect the seventh day as a Sunday, as mentioned in the Bible. I do not think that God has restricted us in that way. One can also respect God on another (seventh) day, for example a Monday or Thursday!

I do think though, that there should be a balance. There should be order and to that, discipline. A calendar with which all people can relate to no matter what your beliefs are or which country you live in. There must be time to appreciate the sun, the moon and the stars, (see The Full Calendar of Order) and following this, coming to respect God and all He has created. I even dare to say that without this appreciation, there never can be a world-order. A world where everyone can live in freedom and peace. Let everyone live time as suits her/him best but with the belief that God is the Time. (See ../../science/index.html Bhagavat Gita, Chapter 10, verse 30 and 33 and Chapter 11, verse 32) and in more detail: Srimad Bhagavatam,

To conclude, since a year I have lived with a different time-calendar, the one which can be found under ../../science/index.html (The Full Calendar of Order). It turned out to be my 'liberation' from wrong time management, from 'maya', not at once, but in experiencing the healing effect of it. I have become more Time Aware and with that comes the happiness of Being. I will certainly continue 'living' this time-consciousness. Try yourself! It may bring you that what you always were looking for!

I would like to thank the webmaster for his valuable work given in this website and for providing the space for discussing this. We need it urgently.

M. L.


received 12-10-2000

Dear people,

It is impossible to respect the 7 day cycle by keeping a 15 day cycle, the two numbers are co-prime. Also it is impossible to respect absolute time by keeping cyclical local time-zone time, as the two give different values for the same presence. Therefore you have made a decision whilst trying hard not to do so, which is wholly in disagreement with the way of the one true God of the Bible, the God of Israel and Abraham and Isaac(who were Hebrews). After thinking for some time that your decision is turning out right, you will find the terrible mistake you have made, I cannot say when this will come to you.

In sevice and love of the one true God and the love of all men and the truth,

R. W. C.


sent 12-10-2000

Dear Mr. Chamberlain

Maybe from your vision it is impossible to respect a seven days week in 24 15-day annual periods. But from intersecting days, namely a fifteenth day at the end of a fortnight and an extra season day each two months we can perfectly manage a 48-weeksystem. This is no problem as you can see if you take the trouble to check our pages as mailed to you before on the Full Calendar of Order. As you can see, we actually manage a different time-consciousness.

Further, what you say about local time relating to zonetime. we have no problem either. If you followed the discussion with Mr. Dinger from the Swatch company you may remember that we have a dual timerespect relating true solar time to the present conceptions of standard time (thus we actively relate to regular mean time, zone time and summertime). For this we use special watches giving two times: standard time and true time we settle to the correction table given at the Full Calendar of Order. The Swatch company has its own version about this dual time calling it Biel time (UTC set to Biel in Switzerland, also called internet time managing so called Swatch beats). We do the same but then relate the time of the sundial to a standardtime clock using each time for what it is most suitable for. We have no problem with it and are very happily applying this system for more than a year now. It is no theory, it is a practice in its separate divisions prescribed by as well Jewish, Hindu as Muslim scripture. Although that scripture is thus not the bible only (from which as said we respect the seven day period for sundays or the Sabbath as you say) we hope you understand our unity of religions approach in this. Maybe you remember the passages in the Bible that state that one should investigate/respect all different times and cultures and keep the best of them:


Eccl 5 Whoso keepeth the commandment shall know no evil thing; and a wise man's heart knoweth time and manner. 6 For to every purpose there is time and manner.

Eccl 3:17God will bring to judgment both the righteous and the wicked, for there will be a time for every activity, a time for every deed."

Eccl. 3  1There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven:

2a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot,

3a time to kill and a time to heal, a time to tear down and a time to build,

4a time to weep and a time to laugh, a time to mourn and a time to dance,

5a time to scatter stones and a time to gather them, a time to embrace and a time to refrain,

6a time to search and a time to give up, a time to keep and a time to throw away,

7a time to tear and a time to mend, a time to be silent and a time to speak,

8a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace.


Thus we did. We believe this is a possible way towards a coherent worldorder of timemanagement reconciling all religious differences. Therefore we invite you to study our pages at carefully and join us in our friendship living a solution for the differences of time-politics in the world. We believe it is a terrible mistake not to acknowledge the different timeoptions of mankind. Many ways of human cultural timerespect for the one God of time lead thus to the same God and order of time (be it as complex as our cultures are all together). Only respect for oneother this way can make an acceptable worldpeace, not the supposed absolute of one opinion of timerespect against another one by saying it is erroneous.

Moreover another associate of The order of Time has added a comment to your letter. We have placed it at the same place as we will with this response: ../../info/discussion/bibletime.html


Hoping to have informed you to your satisfaction....


webmaster The Order of Time



This discussion started 9 dec 2000